Melissa Travers [00:05] Hello, and thanks for tuning in to the Non-Base podcast. I am Melissa Travers, director of community here at Bevnet CPG Media, and this is our How Do I Build this series, where we share practical advice to help CPG brands build stronger businesses. The next wave of functional beverage innovation is becoming less about category and more about occasion and desired effect. Consumers are looking for beverages that help them focus, relax, support their health, or simply feel a certain way at a particular moment in the day. But turning those ideas into products that people actually want to drink can get complicated pretty quickly. Today we are getting into what it actually takes to build those beverages, from choosing functional ingredients and matching flavor to function to overcoming formulation and the challenges that come with scale. Joining me from. Vibrant ingredients are Brittany Strickland and Emily Ria. Vibrant works with beverage brands on ingredients, flavor, and formulation, and they help take concepts from what they call formula to final sip. So it's so great to have you both here, Brittany and Emily. Thank you so much for joining me on the non-based podcast. Awesome to be here. All right, so before we get into what's changing in functional beverage, can you give us a quick sense of where vibrant fits into the product development process? So, you know, what kinds of problems are brands bringing to your team, and what are you, and what are you each kind of working on in that process?
Speaker 2 [01:39] In today's world, consumers have so much information at their fingertips, and you know, with social media. Media and just all of the trends and things that everyone's seeing on the shelves, we're getting a multitude of briefs around different functional beverages like you mentioned in the intro, just really how do I want to feel. So, you know, it's not just energy or hydration or immunity support anymore. It's, I want to relax and I want to unwind, and these are the kinds of beverages that you're seeing come out in the marketplace today.
Melissa Travers [02:10] Mollie, how about you? You know, what, what's your role in the formulation process and what do you do over there at Vibrant Ingredients?
Speaker 3 [02:20] Yeah, so I'm a beverage developer and, you know, much like what Brittany was saying, I think a lot of our development has been shifting in a way to more of like a, a mood or a mindset, and I think that's, you know, changing the way that we develop, thinking about not necessarily ingredients as individuals, but maybe a collection of ingredients that, you know, makes the consumer feel a certain way.
Melissa Travers [02:44] So, you know, we've talked a lot about that shift, the shift from Um, you know, something like energy to I want to feel alert maybe in the afternoon, that kind of thing, you know, we're going from what am I drinking to how do I want to feel when you take a look at those briefs that are coming into vibrant. What has actually changed? Are brands starting with that desired feeling or occasion and then working backwards into ingredients and format, or are you sort of coaxing them into that? How do I want to feel? What do you see coming in?
Speaker 2 [03:20] So I really think the biggest shift that consumers are moving to is away from choosing the beverage based on what's in the can or the bottle, right? So it can be a coffee drink, an energy drink, a hydration. They're really choosing to purchase beverages based on how they want to feel. So those briefs we're really seeing are being framed around those different need states. So I would like to unwind or I would like to relax and You know, the established benefits, energy, hydration, immunity, gut health, those are not going away. What they're doing is becoming expectations. So really the next layer is going to come around connecting those benefits to a specific moment or desired occasion. So maybe on the front, you know, it's, it's the packaging is really calling out that, that how I want to feel. But still, those elements underneath of what's in the beverage are still energy focused, uh, hydration, immunity, all of those things. And really, you know, we have some interesting data to share that supports this. And in this consumer shift, Mintel found that nearly 60% of US consumers are interested in calming and relaxing functional beverage claims. And the Gen Z and millennial demographics, they're over-indexed for that. So 69% of those demographics are interested in these functional beverage beverages. And what that tells us is mental and emotional need states are really becoming part of how consumers think about functionality. So not just traditional benefits like energy, hydration, or immunity anymore.
Speaker 3 [04:51] I think going off of that from a development perspective, I mean, a lot of our customers are looking to us as like the experts. So, yeah, you know, like Brittany was saying, they might, you know, call out a certain need state that they're looking for, but it's up to us and, you know, the technical knowledge that we have to kind of, you know, incorporate ingredients in there that will, that will support that.
Melissa Travers [05:15] You know, I'm curious, Emily, how does this shift again from what am I drinking to how do I want to feel, how does that shift change what, how you ultimately develop a beverage? Is there any change in the development process, or is it pretty much the same?
Speaker 3 [05:32] There's definitely differences for sure, um, and honestly, I think the more unique and novel the ingredients become and, you know, the more that they trend. It's more difficult for us to, you know, incorporate them into beverages. Obviously, a lot of brands want to do something that makes it more, you know, complex or adds character or some kind of differentiation in their ingredient inclusions. But, you know, those also come with challenges, whether it's, you know, cost. It could be, you know, solubility challenges. It could be, you know, fallout. Adaptogens, for example, is a big one. I think that, you know, they're becoming more and more. Um, popular, um, but, in, you know, we actually had some customer briefs come in looking for, for mushroom in their, in their product line. And, you know, those have been pretty difficult to, to get into solution. You know, they obviously have a taste impact. So, yeah, I think the, the more Complex these ingredients become, you know, we always have to kind of figure out a way to incorporate them. But at the end of the day, you know, that's, that's like, that's the fun part of the job and like finding the sweet spot, you know, between the function, the flavor, and uh the rest of the formulation details. And when it all comes together, it's, it's rewarding for sure. You
Melissa Travers [06:43] know, I would think with this shift that your clients, so folks who are, you know, building. Consumer packaged goods, brands and beverages, I would think that your expertise probably comes in more valuable almost than ever before if you come in with a more broad concept that I want to build a beverage that helps people calm down, you know, before bed, that kind of thing. So I'm sure that, you know, all of your clients really appreciate all of the knowledge that you have.
Speaker 3 [07:12] I think it does. It makes it fun and we're able to be like more creative in a sense, you know, like, kind of working closely with marketing. I mean, Brittany also is awesome. Um, so, yeah, being able to figure out what, what those more niche ingredients are, what trends are out there, and then incorporate them on the bench and figure out a way to get it commercialized is, is really cool.
Melissa Travers [07:32] So as we were getting ready for this podcast, you both also talked about tempo drinking. So that idea that consumers are looking for different things at different times of the day, so energy in the morning, focus in the afternoon, calming down at night from all of that energy and focus that you were doing during the day. Where are you seeing the most interesting briefs come in around this idea? I mean, I'm sure you guys see so many briefs and you really do. have a finger on the pulse of what's trending right now. So what are some of the, what are some of the briefs you're seeing come in that are most interesting?
Speaker 2 [08:09] One thing to say to start off is, you know, really when we think about tempo drinking, it's like you mentioned, it's an all day beverage journey. So when I wake up in the morning, I'm looking for that quick jolt of energy, and by, you know, mid-afternoon I want to focus. And of course at 9 o'clock I don't want energy anymore, so I'm ready to settle down and unwind. But some of the most interesting briefs we're getting is the fact that it's not just Gonna come in and say, build me an energy drink anymore. You know what it's gonna say is I want a clean energy drink that has sustained energy throughout the day without any of the jitters or that, that hard crash, right? So, or I need a focused beverage that that allows me to, um, you know, have a good afternoon and kind of continue throughout my. day or really I want to unwind, so give me that, you know, nighttime sleepy mocktail in a can or something along those lines. So what that does is it changes the flavor, the format, and the functional system we build around it. So that's where Emily and all the flavors team come into play and all of their expertise, you know, at the end of the day, if the beverage doesn't taste. Tastes great, the customer's not going to continue to purchase it, right? So when I think about tempo drinking, I really think about it simply as a framework of, you know, different need states throughout the day. And so I'm going to consume a beverage that hits those times of day and what I'm looking to feel as a, as a, you know, as I go throughout my day. Also, I think, you know, there's so many brands on the market today, no matter what beverage category you're talking about, right? We're not, we're not, you know, the most brand loyal demographic anymore. So we love to try all new kinds of beverages and foods, and I think this really hits home for, for a lot of people.
Melissa Travers [09:59] You know, I would also think that tempo drinking helps establish routines in a consumer's behavior, so it's not like, oh, I want a tasty beverage with my lunch. It's, I want this specific beverage because I know it's going to help me get through the rest of my afternoon. And when you create a routine, you also build velocity. So do you see, you know, this sort of onset of tempo drinking and having a specific beverage for a specific mood at a specific time of day really help brands cement themselves in a consumer's routine?
Speaker 2 [10:35] I think so, and I mean we help both CPG and food service brands and beverage, and I think you're seeing it across not just the shelf but also on the menu. So, you know, you're seeing food service operators launch mocktails, you know, it's not just about alcoholic beverage or cocktails anymore. You're seeing them, you know, launch clean energy or or even, you know, we do get sometimes questions like Emily mentioned around mushroom coffee. So it's our job to help them from formula to final sip, right? You know, whether we can acquire all of those raw ingredients that can give you the desired effects of what mushrooms gonna do in that beverage, you know, or, or, hey, is this really just a niche ingredient that, you know, may not, you know, smaller emerging brands, they're putting up a lot of capital to bring their product to market, right? So, trying to help them and guide them along the way as a partner in a one-stop solution.
Melissa Travers [11:32] So certainly social media comes into play when we think about trendsetting and then the folks who are developing beverages, you know, the, um, the impetus that drives them to create what they create, and you actually made an interesting point about social media acting almost like a consumer lab, so people are creating rituals and sharing them. And then some of those are turning into commercialized beverages. When a trend comes to your team, how do you take it from an interesting consumer behavior to a commercially viable beverage, because those are two very different things.
Speaker 2 [12:11] Absolutely. And I think social is a great place to start to see what are the signals in the trends. You know, I'm, I'm guilty of it myself. I go on Instagram and TikTok and I see a beverage and I have to stop what I'm doing and go in the kitchen and see what, what do I have that I can, you know, recreate this. And, you know, it might be our technical team's worst nightmare. You know, I might try something and then call them up the next day and be like, is this something that we can execute against, you know, at mass scale? Like how How does that work? So, you know, I think you're seeing in this calming and unwinding category, right? You've got beverages coming from social media around like tart cherry with magnesium, you know, that they call it the sleepy time mocktail. And that really, truly is one of my favorites that I make quite often is you just take tart cherry juice, maybe a little splash of ginger ale, and there you go. You've got a great nighttime mocktail that's going to still. Have you sleeping good and feeling good when you wake up the next morning. So that's my personal favorite. And really it is our job to understand what the consumers are trying to achieve in that ritual, right? So I can't just toss it over to the technical team and say to translate this into a great tasting beverage. We've got to make sure that again it can be produced at scale. And you know, you're seeing much more of these hit social media nowadays all the time. You've got influencers who just, that's, that's their job is they create this content around beverages. And back to the, to, you know, the mocktails and alcohol consumption, we're seeing alcohol consumption reduced. So 43% of Gen Z and millennials are actively seeking to reduce their consumption of alcohol. And that really plays into this category of how do I want to feel beverages.
Melissa Travers [14:01] Emily, I see you laughing and smiling over there, but I'm wondering if you're grimacing inside because it does seem like a big job to take something that someone sees on social media to a commercially viable beverage. What has to be figured out before the formulation becomes real,
Speaker 3 [14:19] Brittany? Kind of said it herself before, thankfully, before they, you know, send it off to the technical team, they try and do a little, you know, digging as to like why, you know, why are why are consumers, why are people on social media putting these things together? Um, and I think, you know, they can kind of get us a pretty good message, but we dig into it from a technical standpoint. You know, like the tart cherry and the magnesium, you know, they're, they're there for, for sleep and for relaxation. So, I think kind of figuring out the messaging behind why they're doing that and then implementing it with ingredients that make sense for, you know, a CPG space or, or even in food service. Um, so, I think, I think that's, uh, that's kind of where, where I take that information and we got to obviously bring it, bring it home, make it something that we can, um, actually manufacture.
Melissa Travers [15:08] So we've talked a lot about some of the raw ingredients. It's something that I think is really fascinating to hear how experts like yourselves think about, you know, some of those things like mushrooms, tart cherry juice, that kind of thing. Time is money in every business probably, but certainly in CPG and for the folks who are listening to this, you know, maybe if we can help them understand some of these ingredients and help them dial in their ideas a little bit, you know, maybe your jobs will be a little bit easier as well on the development side. So let's get into the ingredient toolkit and let's start out with adaptogen. So when we think about adapt. gen s we think about things like mushroom extracts, ginseng, ashwagandha. When a brand wants to build around one of these, all of these, what do they need to think through around dosage, flavor, what it's paired with, and cost? What are some of the things that the brands out there need to think about when they're thinking about adaptogens like the ones that I just mentioned and maybe other ones that you see come across your desks?
Speaker 3 [16:14] I think the first thing to think about is, you know, which side of the spectrum are you playing, right? Do you want those adaptogens included at, like, you know, clinical levels, or is it just something on your label that kind of helps to support the story that you're trying to tell with uh whatever beverage it is that you're making? Um, I know that I had already kind of touched on mushrooms a little bit earlier, but, you know, one of the biggest development challenges I've been seeing with that is, um, the ability to incorporate it in an RTD. You know, there's some solubility challenges. There definitely is a taste. And if you're trying to get it to an effective dose level, it just kind of like exponentially increases. All those problems, right? Cost, flavor, and obviously the solubility challenges as well. But then that, uh the other side of things, if you're just wanting that in there to kind of like, you know, help play into the story, you know, of, of a focus type beverage, you know, if consumers are seeing that, even though it might not be at like a, you know, quote-unquote clinical level, it could still, you know, spark interest from the consumer and, you know, Help your brain become successful. Ashwaganddo is a, is another big one that I've seen in this space. Um, and there's a, there's a lot of strong clin clinical evidence for this, you know, supporting uh stress support. It's been around a while, but definitely easier to incorporate than the mushrooms. Obviously, there's some taste implications with this one as well. Each of these Ingredients brings their, you know, own set of formulation challenges. Um, and, you know, I kind of mentioned it before, but as a developer, we're, we're working on ways to balance the efficacy or what the, you know, what the customer is wanting for their brand along with the taste and, you know, obviously, having it be practical to bring to a commercial setting and, you know, eventually put on the shelves.
Melissa Travers [17:59] So, I'm just curious, does Ashwagandha have a strong flavor that you need to Mask, match, that kind of thing.
Speaker 3 [18:09] Depending on the level. I think that's kind of like the, that's kind of the golden rule for all of these things. Um, some are obviously worse than others, but, you know, ashwagandha, I've seen, yeah, it does kind of give like a, a, a root type flavor, a little bit dirty, earthy, and that comes, you know, when we, when you take those ingredients and put them into, you know, different beverages, that's kind of the fun part of the formulation is figuring out, you know, like, What other ingredients can I incorporate that help tell the story, but also help to kind of either, you know, complement or mask the flavor. Um, and then even, you know, using natural flavors, that's obviously a big tool in our toolbox. So, figuring out, you know, are we using masking tools, modifiers, you know, what types of flavors, you know, complement this. I think that's, that's kind of the name of the game for, for all these types of ingredients.
Melissa Travers [18:57] I promise you I'm not going to go down a list of functional ingredients, but I just have two more that I want to ask you about because I know so many of the people who are listening are either thinking about using these or they already do. Two of the functional ingredients that I see come through the bevnet doors the most often are magnesium and L-theanine. What can you tell us about those two? And then I promise I'll stop.
Speaker 3 [19:23] L-theanine, that's honestly one of my faves. We have a strong tea platform here at Vibrant Ingredients, and I think, you know, that's one of our natural ingredients derived from, from tea, and it's seen kind of in two different spaces, right? I mean, I think magnesium is, is, you know, very closely linked to, you know, recovery, sleep, relaxation. Where L-theanine can kind of be used in the energy and focus space along with that relaxation space, you know, caffeine with L-theanine that gives a very, you know, very clean energy type sustained energy, supposed to reduce crashes and, you know, feeling anxious from, from that, that blend of ingredients. On the flip side, yeah, it does also, because it gives you that sustained energy in the energy space, it's able to kind of like keep you calm, keep you steady in the, you know, in the relaxation space as well.
Melissa Travers [20:13] Are any of the ingredients that we just talked about in terms of functional ingredients, are any of them specifically an issue when it comes to cost, or are they all kind of in the same ballpark? How does that work?
Speaker 3 [20:28] The more unique the ingredient and the less, you know, like space that it takes up on the market, the more costly it most likely is. Things like L-theanine, you know, and magnesium, they're fairly common, and, you know, depending on the You know, the, the source, you usually you can find those in a, in a lot of different beverages where you go into like the mushrooms of the, of the world, that could be, you know, something that becomes more expensive. And like I had mentioned, because of the technical challenges working with that ingredient, you know, there are some vendors that have maybe been working on ways to solve that, but obviously, You know, that extra technology that's put into the raw material that increases the price tag for, for customers to use.
Melissa Travers [21:09] Brittany, from a marketing perspective, how do you guide your clients on that topic that Emily was just talking about? You know whether the ingredients are being used at a clinical level or maybe if they're just sort of part of the formulation landscape, you know, how do you make sure that the ingredient is actually at a level that delivers on its promise versus just appearing on the label?
Speaker 2 [21:36] That's actually where I've been thinking about as you guys are having this conversation. I don't know that from a consumer standpoint there is any one data point that says if I'm looking for a drink that has altheanine in it, I, as a consumer expect it's going to have a clinical dosage or anything like that or any type of claim or what that means, because, you know, we would have to divert to a technical team or you would want the brand to work with their own technical team to ensure any claims that they put on packaging. are accurate in what they want to stand behind, right? Um, but I don't see anywhere that consumers are out there holding, you know, brands to to to make the claim on the can. They just want to know that altheanine or Ashwagandha or anything is out there. Now. I'm not saying that, you know, if you do want to make a clinical dosage claim, you have to do your homework and your research and make sure you're, you're doing that properly, but I don't have any data that supports, you know, a customer is expected. X amount of um mushroom or anything in a beverage. At the end of the day, what it comes down to is back to it has to taste great. So, if you can't get a clinical dosage amount of a certain ingredient into a beverage and without it, you know, you have to then go add the masking ingredients or the blockers or whatever, all that technical mumbo jumbo, you know, I don't know it all, but um I know just enough to be dangerous. So if you have to do all that to then get it to taste. Just good It's not going to work. So it has taste great, has to have the, you know, ingredients that the consumer are looking for, for those desired effects. But at the end of the day, I think customers really just want to, you know, feel good when they drink a beverage.
Melissa Travers [23:21] And as clients are coming to you with their, you know, formulation requests, when you think about something like mushrooms, from what you know, I've seen and understand, there's, there's less of an expectation in terms of milligrams versus something like maybe magnesium. Or L-theanine, which is a supplement that people, you know, take for specific reasons. Do you guide clients differently based on what the functional ingredient is and how consumers may be taking them as a supplement or not really that much?
Speaker 2 [23:54] No, I wouldn't say really that much. Again, I think it's down to the brand and what they want, what their expectations are for their final, final product. I'm a big proponent of all of these ingredients. We're talking about althee and magnesium. I use them, you know, what you're seeing is consumers go from, I consume these as a supplement, right? Cause that's, you know, today, that's how I take magnesium is through a supplement to, I want to, you know, put them in, go ahead and include them in my beverage. That's one less thing I have to worry about, right? Um, so,
Speaker 3 [24:26] and I think on top of that, it's like a fun way too, right? That's like a, instead of taking, whether it's like a pill or, you know, like a tablet or something, you get to drink it. So I feel like that, that makes it cool.
Melissa Travers [24:38] Yeah, and you know if it's something like magnesium, for example, I've heard that your body can't digest as many milligrams as maybe you might get in a product like Natural Calm or, you know, some, some kind of supplement. So if you are using a functional ingredient throughout the day, maybe in a fun way through a beverage at lunch and then you're taking your supplement at night, it probably makes you feel like You're a little bit more covered as a consumer. All right, let's get into botanicals and teas. So we're talking about things like hibiscus, lemon balm, chamomile. Those ingredients can contribute both flavor and function. What do those bring to a beverage and what are some of the common formulation issues that you see with things like botanicals when, you know, folks are bringing them to you for formulation?
Speaker 3 [25:29] You touched on it well. I think, I, I personally like formulating with botanicals. I think that they're, they're really a dual functioning ingredient. I mean, some more than others, but they, you know, they contribute flavor a little bit, and I think it helps to tell the functional story. Well, we'll jump into hibiscus. That was one of the ones that you mentioned. I mean, That one's kind of like, that, that has 3, you know, bonus checks for me. I mean, it, you know, gives you flavor, it gives you color, and it gives you functionality at once. Um, I think one of the, one of the challenges with using this ingredient is, you know, the, the tartness and acidity that comes with it. So, you know, obviously, developing the remainder of the beverage to make sure that, you know, it tastes balanced, it tastes delicious. I mean, at the end of the day, we, we don't want to drink things that don't taste good. But then also, you know, pairing. It with flavors that complement it, you know, it kind of has like a tart berry characteristic. So, we wouldn't, you know, probably put something that's like peach mango with it, you know, like it's also, it's also pink and red in nature. So, you know, making sure that we're, we're formulating smart in that way, you know, choosing flavors that makes sense for the ingredient that we're using. And then I know that you mentioned lemon balm. I think that's another great one. Supports calming and relaxation. And I think that ingredient also does have a little bit of flavor that comes from it, similar to the, similar to the hibiscus, but, you know, that flavor supports the mood state that people are incorporating that ingredient in. Good example, like if you had a rocket pop flavored, you know, relaxation beverage, most people probably would be confused, right? They would probably wouldn't want to go for, go for something like that. So I think, again, you know, pairing it with the right flavors and just like, And, and the same thing with the, with the base formulation. If it was like super acidic or super sweet, you know, people aren't gonna really want to be consuming that before bed or when they're trying to wind down. So, I think, you know, when those ingredients come, you know, through the queue and they're asking us to incorporate them, it's just, we got to think about more than just like putting it in the beverage. It's like, what is, what is the story that this beverage is trying to sell? And, you know, like, how can we kind of like put all the puzzle pieces together to make it make sense, but also make it be delicious.
Melissa Travers [27:37] All right, let's get on to some of the original functional beverages, and those are teas and coffees. I know that vibrant ingredients works with green tea extracts, matcha, cold brew, and, you know, those are position. Oftentimes around this idea of clean energy. Clean energy is something that I hear and see all day long, but I would love to ask, you know, you both, you're the experts, what does clean energy actually mean to you?
Speaker 3 [28:09] Clean energy, you know, I love caffeine, so, but I think when people are talking about clean energy, they're not talking about, you know, like the caffeine chemistry or like breaking things down like that. I think. It, it kind of goes back to what we were saying before, you know, it, it's about how the energy beverage makes you feel, right? A good clean energy beverage helps you to feel productive, to feel focused, kind of like a sustained energy. It's not, you're not feeling like it's spiking. So, yeah, it's like taking away that overstimulation and anxiety that a lot of people associate with like more, you know, traditional energy brands, um, and just kind of You know, a more sustained, sustained focus is what people are looking for and what people associate with clean energy.
Melissa Travers [28:51] So does that, you know, absence of jitters and presence of like a clean energy, where does that come from? I know you guys talked a little bit about your extraction process. Is that, is that where you get the clean energy?
Speaker 3 [29:05] We have, you know, a few different items within our platforms. I think, you know, yesterday talking with Brittany, she had a, she had a great point. I think, you know, like our cold brew, for example, one of the OG functional beverages, right? I mean, before energy drinks existed, people were drinking coffee all day to stay focused and productive. So, I think, you know, we've had a lot of, a lot of work go into that part of our vibrant portfolio, a lot of technology. And focus, creating something that's, you know, extremely clean, easy to build out into a functional beverage. So you're getting, you know, great flavor without the acidic bite. And yeah, so it's just, it's really clean. We have a, a, a lot of, you know, good things coming from our cold brew business. Matcha is more like the new kid on the block. So, you know, like consumers love it. Um, it has like a, a premium wellness-focused, you know, energy story surrounding it. You know, as a developer, I think it's a little bit more difficult to use ingredients like this. I think, you know, especially in like an RTD space, there's some, you know, concerns with, you know, stability, fallout, and then off notes and bitterness. But, you know, we have a lot of, you know, food service business as well. Where this, you know, definitely is a big contender in the, in growing in that space. So, yeah, it's, it's, it's exciting. It's an exciting ingredient to work with, I think, uh, flavor-wise, but also the, the visual of it too. I mean, like a, a green beverage is obviously cooler than the traditional browns, the shades of browns that we've had in like coffee and tea. And then green tea, that's, to me, that's the workhorse, right? I mean, there's a lot of different things that come from green tea. The extraction capabilities that we have here, you know, allow us to kind of, you know, pinpoint and narrow down what we're looking to, looking to get out of it. So, like for, you know, functionality purposes, we can extract caffeine from the green tea, the L-theanine. And um like I had mentioned before, those two in combination, very, very common in the, in the clean energy type beverage space.
Speaker 2 [31:01] You're seeing so many again, whether it's on the shelf or on the menu, green tea-based beverages, a lot of them in the refresher format, you know, which falls into functional beverage. And then from a cold brew perspective, yes, you know, our original claim to fame was we were cold brew before it was cool, so you know we've got over 20 years. Of proprietary process under our belt to create a beverage that, you know, not only tastes great, it's only got two ingredients. It's just coffee and water, you know, run through a proprietary extraction process. So you're not going to get that acidic bite that you may get in a cold brew made at home or a cold brew that an operator makes back of the house. So these are the foundation of a great tasting beverage system, and you know that that's what we can help and deliver to customers.
Melissa Travers [31:55] I remember the first time I had a cold brew. I think I got halfway through it, and I mean it's like, wow, this is a whole different story. I definitely feel like that put energy on the map in a way that, you know, maybe hadn't existed before. I do have a question about matcha. You know, matcha, you commented. that it has this green color and we do see that colored beverages like, you know, ube is another ingredient that we hadn't seen a ton of before that we see a little bit more of now, you know, partially the color of the beverage may factor in more now because of social media and people are posting pictures of things and it's cool to have, you know, a colored beverage that. Looks really interesting. I am really curious about matcha because again it's something we see come through the doors all the time. What are the specific challenges with matcha? You mentioned bitterness. I find that like canned matcha sometimes like you get the bitterness but you maybe lose a little bit of that grassy flavor. What is, what's the, what are the challenges with matcha?
Speaker 3 [33:01] But in my experience, it's been like the solubility of it, like the fallout over time and especially like when you're, you know, a canned matcha, for example, or, or anything that goes through maybe like some type of heat preservation process. It kind of, it changes the flavor profile. And I mean, um, apart from matcha, it happens with a lot of different products that we, that we work with, you know. Everything can kind of taste good or taste, you know, tastes good enough on the bench, but then when you bring it to, you know, A little bit further down in the development process, that's kind of when, you know, things can change and shift. And
Melissa Travers [33:36] when you say fallout, do you mean that the matcha is literally falling out of the solution? It's like almost like sediment.
Speaker 3 [33:43] Yes, yes, sorry, like not soluble in the water.
Melissa Travers [33:46] You both actually made a point that I hadn't really heard framed this way before, and that's that extracts and natural flavors aren't necessarily an either or choice, but rather they're tools that can work really well together. How do you use those in combination to build a flavor system that a brand is looking to achieve?
Speaker 3 [34:10] Even though I'm a beverage developer, I like to think of this kind of if, like the example is if you're building a, an ice cream sundae. So we have our extracts, our essences, and our natural flavors. So the extract is like, it's like the ice cream, right? It's the foundation of your entire sundae. It delivers, you know, the core character. Usually the functional benefits come from that, the mouthfeel, the color, um, and it's kind of everything else that the, that the rest of the beverage is built on. And then the tea essence is kind of Like the hot fudge, right? Like as soon as you throw the hot fudge onto your sundae, you know it's there. You, you can't miss it. It tastes of something for sure. And that's kind of the same thing with the tea essence, right? We're adding that into, into our beverage and we're getting, you know, the fresh brewed aromas and top notes and, and, and those types of flavors that just kind of hit you in the face as soon as you open the, open the container. And then, I would say the toppings on your sundae are like our natural flavors. So this is really where, you know, the customization happens, you know, like what do you want your, your beverage to taste like. And it, and it's the fun part too. Like you mentioned, we have a lot of different, you know, customers asking for different things and I think that's one of the benefits to You know, our, our portfolio of tea and, and flavor ingredients. Um, you know, some, some might want an energy beverage where the extract is there more for functional needs and the essence and the flavor are, are driving the profile of the beverage. And then we have some customers that might want a more premium tea beverage, right? So they want a, you know, a really good tasting extract and like maybe even like a varietal of essence. Um, and then some, you know, some just want tea in the beverage and they want it to be really fruit-forward or really flavor forward. So I think, That's one of the cool things about the, at the, you know, the capabilities that we have at Vibrant. We're able to fully customize these tea and flavor systems for our customers depending on, you know, what they're looking for and whatever guardrails they may have. So, whether it's cost or, you know, flavor profile, or even the operational capabilities when they go to take this to market, even though we're, we're, we're making tea and not ice cream. Sorry, I, I got to close the loop on the Sunday here. Um. It's just it, it is very similar in a way because we have to find the right balance and layer everything. So at the end of the day we're, we're making something delicious that our customers are like, customers like, but then also the consumers continue to buy, you know, off the shelf.
Speaker 2 [36:30] So that's the cherry on top, right? There we go. That's
Speaker 3 [36:33] it.
Melissa Travers [36:34] Yeah, that
Speaker 3 [36:35] is the cherry on, yeah.
Melissa Travers [36:38] Can you, can you explain what the difference is between an extract, an essence, and a natural flavor?
Speaker 3 [36:45] Yeah, sure. So the extract is gonna be more of like the, like the tea leaves, like the solids portion. So that's gonna be, it could be either be a liquid or a solid, like a powdered solid, but essentially, it's, it's the tea leaves. Dehydrated in some form or concentrated in, in the liquids um scenario. Um, so that will give you, you know, the, the brown color or if it, if it's green, it'll be, you know, like the lighter brown, light green. And usually, it has, like I said, a lot of the body, a lot of the, you know, uh, astringency attached with it as well. And really, you need the essence. To complement that in order to make it feel like a full tea beverage. So the essence is more of, it's, it's the top notes, it's the aroma. It's, it's what comes, comes out. It's, it's captured essentially. It's, it's almost like tea water in a sense. So, putting those two things together really, like I said, makes it a full tea beverage. And then, Natural flavors. I mean, sometimes we do have, you know, our natural flavors with, with tea components that we have in our, in our toolbox that kind of just fully round out that tea experience. And then, you know, otherwise, we have, you know, different, different chemical components that make up natural flavors. Maybe they're more fruit-forward, maybe, you know, they're citrus, maybe they're berry, um, but, you know, sometimes those are added to, into the tea. Beverage to differentiate it that way.
Melissa Travers [38:11] What I hear you talking about is really cohesion. And that relates to something that we were talking about a little bit earlier, and that's that the flavor of a beverage should really match the function. A calming beverage shouldn't necessarily deliver the same sensory experience as something that's designed for energy. Can you give some advice or some tips on how you think about building the flavor around the experience that the beverage is promising?
Speaker 2 [38:42] So I think I could take that one for you. I, I really think you have to, you know, start with the brief, you know, like you said, what, what is the beverage looking to deliver, um, and what are those functional ingredients. And then what we can do from a marketing standpoint is look at our insights tools and kind of pair what are the trending flavors in other beverages that have been newly launched in the market, right? So, you know, to Emily's point, you don't want a rocket pop flavored unwinding drink. Um, so that, that likely would not show up in my results that I can pass along to the technical team to say, here are maybe like the top 5 trending flavors that, that should work best, um, and then she takes it and runs with it. So, um, it creates an, you know, sometimes she's a marketer at heart, so she can kind of play in both worlds and take what I give her and, and then take it to the next level. So, I really think it's that, that team approach that allows us to, to really set us apart.
Speaker 3 [39:42] One of the things I've, I've learned throughout my years of beverage development, you know, making a great beverage on the bench is really only half the job. We had a customer that asked for a functional beverage. They had strict compliance and cost guardrails, so we had to develop, you know, basically within those parameters. And, you know, on the bench, in the beaker, everything tastes good, color looks good, and, you know, once we got some customer approval on those samples, we moved to start commercializing the product. So at our first trial run, you know, our, our technical team found out that the product was being processed differently than we had been doing it in the lab. So, you know, the conditions that they were processing under, you know, abuse of flavor, changed the profile, and um just showed some challenges with the functional ingredients that were included in the beverage. So, I think, you know, a really cool part about being here at Vibrant is our, you know, kind of ability to, to connect technical to technical. So, you know, we were able to meet up with their technical team and kind of like discuss, you know, what, what was going on, uh, at the Coleman, what was going on in the lab, and how we can kind of bridge the gap. And Yeah. So, so we hit the bench, right? We adjusted the flavor and the formulation based on, you know, the feedback that they gave us. And I think one of the cool parts about being at the, the new in the new vibrant Innovation Center in New Jersey is a lot of pieces of equipment that are able to, to support our customers and, and collaborate with them, you know, really become a one, one-stop shop. Um, so, they're, a piece of equipment here, we were able to, you know, Essentially mimic the processing conditions that the customer was using when they went to, you know, scale up the, up the beverage. And, you know, by doing that and kind of validating our formula in that way, it was, it was really helpful and we were able to, you know, build trust with the customer, but also, you know, feel confident that what we were putting forward was, you know, gonna withstand shelf life and, and processing conditions and I think that's, that's really like the rewarding part of it is, you know, seeing it all the way through from the bench, you know, when you first have it in the beaker to the, to the shelf at the store. And yeah, it's, it's, it's a blend of a lot of different things, right? It's, it's art, it's creativity and fun, but then you also need to take into account, account the science and the engineering and the formulation knowledge. So, I think Brittany said it best yesterday. It's like when all the puzzle pieces come together, you know, it's, it's really exciting. Um, and that's, that's, that's how I feel about making beverages,
Speaker 2 [42:13] right? Our job is to provide a superior sensory experience. And, you know, so ultimately the function is there, but someone has to be interested in that function, purchase it off the shelf. It has to taste great, and then they're going to come back. You know, we don't, we don't want to see an item get pulled off the shelf because it doesn't, doesn't stand up to its claim or its taste or any of that nature.
Melissa Travers [42:38] Well, you know, certainly Vibrant is a great partner to anybody who's formulating a beverage. If I come to Vibrant with a concept and say, here's how I want it to taste, here's how I want the consumer to feel, and here's the price that I need it to hit, walk me through how you get from that brief to a beverage that's actually ready to launch.
Speaker 2 [43:05] Yeah, I think what you just said is what we stand to live by, and that's our from formula to final sips. And so really it starts with what you just said, the consumer experience, how should it taste? How do they want that beverage to make them feel? When are they drinking it? What benefit are they trying to get delivered through the beverage? Then our technical. Team, all the things we've discussed today, right, they're really gonna work backwards from the ingredients, the dosage, the stability, processing, like you said, the guardrails are there from cost, right? You know, a brand may only have a certain budget and then ultimately it has to be able to be scaled up from a manufacturing perspective. Um, we utilize trends and insights to supply, like I mentioned, flavor and consumer trends to our technical team to create a great final beverage. But at the end of the day, function has to work with flavor, and both have to work in the finished beverage for a successful launch. I'll leave everyone with one example. Coffee is a great example of a full system approach and why our from formula to final sip truly matters. We are a one-stop partner solution, so we can take a beverage base, in this case, cold brew, layer in functional ingredients and flavor systems to create a final beverage. The National Coffee Association shows 45% of consumers would drink more coffee if it offered additional health benefits. But on the flip side, 67% say those added ingredients should not change the taste. Function can create an additional reason to choose the beverage, but it cannot come at the expense of the core coffee experience. So for instance, a brief comes into us and the customer says, I'm looking to create a cold brew protein latte. It has to deliver on that functionality of protein. It has to have the taste, whether they're coming to us and saying, I want a trending flavor profile. Maybe that's cookie butter, or I want a classic vanilla protein latte. The consumer, you know, they really don't want to taste that. We talked about dosage and certain things. They don't want to taste that overly chalky protein that you might see in the powder form at home. They want a beverage that has the cold brew, the flavor, and the functionality, and at the end of the day tastes great. Our full beverage systems. Allow us to do that. So we can pull from a multitude of of parts of our company, from our flavors team, from our cold brew and tea extracts, uh, the bases, and then layer in those functional ingredients to create a formulation and have the flavor expertise to back it up. At Vibrant, we truly work with formulators from both big brands and emerging brands to help bring their vision and products to shelves and menus.
Melissa Travers [45:54] I can't thank you enough, Brittany Strickland and Emily Rhea. I feel like I know so much more about beverage formulation now than I did before, and I'm sure that our audience does as well. So, thank you both so much for joining us from Vibrant Ingredients. It's been a pleasure to chat with you and for everybody in the audience, thank you for tuning into the Non-Base podcast, and we will see you next time.
